Fla. Drivers License Changes For Non-immigrant Residents.

[floridapete]

Susie has asked me to bring this discussion to your notice - if the subject hasn't already been discussed before on this Forum:

FLA. DRIVERS LICENSE CHANGES FOR NON-IMMIGRANT RESIDENTS.

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I have just heard that Florida has made changes to it's statutes with regards to the issue of Florida Drivers Licenses to resident non-immigrants (i.e. anyone residing in Florida on anything other than a Green Card or US Citizen status). This means that all those E2, L1, H1b etc. non-immigrant categories will be affected by the following:

http://www.flsenate.gov/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=Ch0322/SEC051.HTM&Title=-%3E2006-%3ECh0322-%3ESection%20051#0322.051

Cutting to the chase - the sections which you need to refer to are (f) and (g) and (VII)

This is going to make a BIG difference for all the above categories of FDL holders who will have to renew their licenses EVERY 1 YEAR with the additional cost, time and effort of doing so. This means that they will be paying 10 times the cost of having an FDL than their USC or GC holding neighbours in Florida !

This seems to be a FLORIDA ONLY THING as other states appear not to have introduced this 'novel' ruling as of Oct. 1st 2006.

Why is the Governor of Florida, Jeb Bush, taking this action to stigmatise his lawful non-immigrant residents even more ! The first ruling to change the FDL laws following 9/11 was always an ill-conceived and flawed piece of legislation which lead many Florida homeowners and snowbirds to sell up and leave because they felt they were being 'criminalised' by the difficulties in getting an FDL, and therefore unable to retain their own cars with great difficulties and extra expense.

Up until now FDL's have been valid to the expiry of your current I/94. This new ruling means that, no matter how long an E2 or L1a, say, may have left on their I/94 - they will only get a one year license issued in Florida

[Bobby]

I'll copy here what I posted on (the other forum) for the benefit of non members there:


It has been briefly discussed after I renewed recently and was only given one year.

It would be interesting to find out EXACTLY why, of course. But I doubt anyone will furnish you with the real reason by phone or letter. "Staff answer" is my guess.

My first thoughts on it were, that it was to curb the amount of illegal immigrants, or over stayers who can still operate quite well with a valid drivers license. Take away the license and life becomes a little bit more illegal. Driving without a license, no Florida ID, no insurance.
Of course there are some (probably most!) who arrive and take their chances without proper documentation and just get on with it, but they have to lay low and it's not a proper existence.
As usual, if you're not a US citizen you get tarred with the same brush as all the rest. Hence why we have to renew yearly even though we have visas for longer.
"sorry, you don't conform, so we'll treat you all the same because it's easier for us"
US citizen or non-US citizen. We'll keep it that simple because we can't think outside the of the box and break it up into legal immigrant, tax payer, employer etc.

Peter, I don't think there'll be a huge percentage on here who would ever have been offered a 10 year license so we're not missing anything there. $100 in revenue back to DMV, over 10 years. It's hardly robbing us blind.
It could be argued inconvenient, but I have tied mine to renew on my birthday and as I'd be there to sort out all the taxes and registrations for all the vehicles, I can just add that to the list, so no harm done.

Bobby

[Susie]

Hi,

Thanks Peter

I agree Bobby, the cost is not a big deal but it amazes me how rules and the way things change overnight when it suits. I have been told (by reliable person) there are many other plans in the pipeline for changes. That is what concerns me more and whilst only hearsay at the moment I cannot post. All I will say is lets be on our guard as to what may hit us next and when

[punky]

Your link's bu**ered Pete, could you update it please?

[floridapete]

Your link's bu--ered Pete, could you update it please?

See: http://www.flsenate.gov/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=Ch0322/SEC051.HTM&Title=-%3E2006-%3ECh0322-%3ESection%20051#0322.051

[punky]

Cheers for that... I have updated the first post.

[Bobby]

Received my new license today. EXACTLY 30 days from the date that I attended the DMV. Bizarre if this is normal procedure! Trying to psyche us out, and make us all paranoid and tired of the system, and just give up and go home I think!

[DebbieM]

Have appointments on Nov 30 to renew ours - will let you know how it goes.

The one on OBT has in the past, issued them on day - I wait with anticipation.

Debs

[chris]

Debbie,
You will not get a plastic card license on the day I'm afraid. We renewed ours in September, so got 2 years - whoopeee!!!! They will give you a 30 day paper non-photo license and you'll get the plastic one in the mail after about 30 days!?. They have changed the design quite a bit since our last one and there are more security features in it. Also for non-res's they do other checks on us in the background. Clearly it is all about making it more difficult for us to function - but for whom one ask? It doesn't affect one blind bit the illegals as they are driving either on no license or fake ID. It only hurts the legals.
I've spoken to a brit friend of mine who knows Frank Atkisson the state rep for Kissimmee. He'll be asking why the change. Their argument for the change will be interesting given that it seems only Florida has changed the rules. As far as the extra cost, that is clearly discrimination. The amount is not the point, it's the principle.

[CanadianNugi]

Hello to all , I have noticed many of you are from Florida facing the same challenges as me in regards to Driver's Licence. What about Homestead?

We have been bundled up with all the unwelcomed here in Florida. We are being treated like illegals and this so far has been happening only in this state with the new rules being imposed.

We all are laying low because no one wants to rock the boat after all they consider us temporary, right?! but if I were illegal I would be able to sent my kids to school for free, get medical attention for free, drive illegaly, dont pay taxes!
Visa holders are being discriminated against...........and if its not hard enough lets make it harder.

The DMV cost is nothing compare to the Property Taxes and the cost of studying at university without homestead.

No one is going to stick their neck out for us we dont have the right to vote and so nothing is going to change.

[DEE F]

Hi Canadiannugi, How right you are , my sentiments exactly" no vote no say"
we are the ones discriminated against, just as you say if we were illegal we could have all the help going,but because in our wisdom we have taken the legal route then we are stuffed, it makes me so mad, perhaps we should all tune in to Hillary Clintons live chatvideo on mon, I will post the web address in a minute, have to go and find it, she is saying that she will change things for the better after 6 years of George Bush, and we can all have our say !!!!!!!!!! so perhaps we should take her up on it, I am not sure how Canadians are treated but I can tell you now that the British are treated like second class citizens and I for one think its time we stood up to be counted, this programme could be a good way of being heard, comments anyone!


Dee xx

[DEE F]

Hi all the web address is www.hillaryclinton.com then go to video,she is asking for everyone to take part in an online discussion on all aspects of problems, all welcome no matter where we are from, could be interesting, I have also probably posted this in wrong section but not sure,anyway will anyone chat to her, couldd be a golden opportunity for us here!!!!!!!!


Dee xx

[CanadianNugi]

Does anyone remember the "Boston Tea Party" which helped to spark the American revolution? The Americans fought the British (nothing personal just a point of reference ;) )for "Taxation without representation". They paid taxes and customs but had no say or voting rights.

However the Americans now have created the same situation with us the legal visa holders to the USA who are paying taxes and have no say or right to say anything.

We should have the right for representation regardless if we are permanent or not. We are TAX PAYERS. They take my money in every way possible in fact 60% of Floridians do not pay their fair share of Property Taxes for the services they demand it is me and you and business owners alike that pay the highest share of property taxes so all the rest of them could drain the system.
Now they are looking for more ways to increase homestead for those same people who use the school system and municipal services. There is no reason that me and you who live and work full time in the USA should pay more for services we cant receive or enjoy. Homestead is nice and beautiful however lets be realistic labour cost is not the same today as it was 20 years ago and what we pay the mayor or the garbage collector today should be shared all across the board if you live here full time or not. In fact those who live here full time should pay their fair share of it since they use it more!

Obviously we are all on E2 visa living and working in the USA because it is allowed so how come we are being treated worse than the Illegals? I am here because we chose to bring our business and expertise here and enjoy the warm weather , however if the hostility towards us continues here in Florida (new rules and regulations that bundle us with the illegals and terrorists) we will move to a friendlier environment.

[chris]

Hey CanadianNugi,
I'll just upset you a little more after you've found out that you only get your FL licence for one year and you don't get Homestead Exemption. You don't get the Cap Limit on County Taxes either! What's that you ask? Well in Florida they have a setup which caps increases on County taxes to no more than 3% per year, if you qualify. So if you are a permanent resident you get your Homestead Exemption and then on top of that, the amount of County Taxes you actually pay is limited by Florida Law to no more than a 3% increase. If you are classed as a non-permanent resident such as an E2'r then you don't get the Homestead exemption and you pay the full whack on any County Tax increase. Mine has gone up by about 50% and that is based solely on the millage increase, not any revaluation of the property itself. If I'd have refinanced or bought and sold this past year, Christ only knows what my County tax bill would be. On another Forum , a british guy with a 2nd home in Clearwater was paying $35,000 pa in County Taxes!!!!!!! - His neighbors less than half. Methinks we non-immigrants must have Cabbage or Soak me stamped on our foreheads?

[Susie]

Hi Chris

And another valid point

Children of L visa holders have a pathway to green card, Cildren of H1 b holders have a pathway to green card.

The dream act illegal children will have a pathway to green card if brought into law

E 2 children, have no chance of a green card, unless they are bright enough to get to university, then get job offer or marry a usc

[CanadianNugi]

Hey Chris,

I have been living here for 3 years and that is why I want the Homestead!!!! I am the highest property taxes payer in my street!!!!!!! and here is something to drive you crazy.............my neighbour is a senior executive at the county appraiser office and she lives on one side of me and have a business property on the other side of me and she arranged it so she doesnt have to pay high property tax on her investment property , somehow it is worth a third of mine. How is that for some little corruption?!
I am already paying 4 times of my original amount, the sky is the limit!
What exactly do I get out of it nada nothing zilch!
We managed to lower our assessed value this past week by fighting hard and putting a strong case but we need the homestead to cap the increases.

[Emmalee25]

With regards to homestead,
my mum and dad are green card holders and therefore eligable for Homestead BUT the embassy c*cked up (yes...really?) and my dad, although listed as GC status doesnt have his GC in his hand, and probably wont for another 6 months (they keep saying 60 days.....60 days.....) anyway he cant get homestead as the mortgage is soley in his name and he doesnt have his GC to hand........an embassy C*ck up, yet who loses out????????

Yep......my dad! not the embassy...........? sigh
Em x

[chris]

Yep,
We foreigners certainly do stand for 'egg under the cap trick'. Taking Nugi's point I 'walked' my street on the Osceola County Property Appraisers website and checked what everyone else was paying. Guess what? I am the only one on my street who deson't get homestead and the only one who doesn't enjoy the cap. Welcome to Florida and thank you for investing in our country - we certainly appreciate your dollars.
I think the egg under the cap for us would be a boiled egg for all the steam that vents from my ears!!!!

[hopefultreatyinvestor]

I arrived in Florida in January 2005 and after a grilling was issued a 2 year license, in February 2006 I moved to Boston - I took my licence in to change to a Mass one and got a license valid for 10 years!!!